All right! What’s up, everyone? Welcome to the Million Dollar Sellers podcast. I'm your host Nick Shucet. Today. We have a long-time member, Reed, on the show today. Reed, I'm super excited to welcome you on the show and happy that you made some time for us, man. How are you doing today?
I'm doing great. I'm doing awesome, actually. And thanks for having me on the show. I'm really honored to be here.
Why don't you let the audience know where you're at, man?
Sure. Well, In life, I'm from Eastern Canada. And I live on a beautiful farm that I was able to purchase through my Amazon business. Amazon does things for people and in a big way. So that's something that, as far as I'm concerned, anyone can do. But as always there are stumbling blocks. So hopefully we can work through some of that as we're talking here and help people out.
Yeah, man. I like what you mentioned about Amazon being able to put you in a position where you could buy something like that. I could definitely relate to that. I feel like success on Amazon allowed me to go after the things I'm passionate about in life. I spent more time with my family and my wife. Is having a farm something you've always wanted to do? Is that something you've been involved in for a while?
Yeah. If I go into a little bit of a backstory to describe myself, I'd say that I'm a serious nature lover. But my love for nature is really unconventional.
I actually went to school for environmental reclamation. Reclamation is the process of cleaning up after land or water has been damaged in some way. And usually, this had to do with any number of oil field accidents. I’d be required to report and go out to clean up an oil spill or test the water to make sure that the activity in the area didn't pollute the water body.
So while I was doing this schooling, I had an epiphany. While I was cleaning it, I asked myself, Why am I cleaning up issues like this and why not just stop the issues before they ever happened? And it was, for me, one of those light bulb moments that you see in cartoons. So right then, and there, I decided that stopping an issue before it ever happened, trumped cleaning up after it had already done damage.
So in order to accomplish this, I made a pretty serious career transition. My first business pursuit after school was as a quality management system specialist for some of the largest companies in the world. So for over 25 years, companies like ConocoPhillips, Husky Energy, or Cenovus Energy. They'd hire me to both develop and enforce their operational business processes in order to develop a quality management system or QMS.
And while creating processes may sound like a boring task, it is actually a pretty serious business. I was tasked with some investigations and these were serious and deadly industry failures. And in the end, all of these catastrophes could be traced to one thing. They all failed to follow standard operating procedures, or SOP for short. Actually, that isn't completely true. Sometimes the procedures weren't developed correctly. So, they lacked some kind of checklist for some critical operations involved with the task.
Coming back to what you were saying, it's from this background that I was also tasked with auditing. I also had to enforce compliance from the subcontractors involved in any of the hundreds of projects going on at any one time within these businesses. So basically when you have that much going on, the rules have to be followed. The only way to be sure that happened was through extreme systemization. And using that systemization potentially stopped so many departmental disasters.
I was able to stand up for the ecosystem right out of the source. For me personally, it was a real source of pride that no environmental issues came up during my 25-year tenure.
I transitioned from that career in 2014 into our newest endeavor, mostly because the oil fields cratered. At the time, I was in Alberta. This new endeavor is a systems framework for Amazon and e-commerce sellers. Since I have lots of expertise in management systems, I decided to apply it to e-commerce. To do that we spent over a hundred thousand dollars building out this framework.
And after countless refinements and stops, our company came out of the other side of that development tunnel with what I feel is a world-class systems framework.
We worked with over a hundred of the largest brands, brand management agencies, and brand aggregators in the industry. And in the process, we developed 17 software solutions along the way. This allowed us to build out a way to test and update SOPs to match the changes on Amazon. As you know, the platform changes all the time. So, if you have a system, you need to keep up with that.
These procedures have allowed me to systemize our business, and they’ve become the foundation of our business operations. We're now able to delegate all of the mundane, repetitive tasks to virtual talent. And, we do that with a minimum expenditure of time in states and, ultimately, money. These systems make it hard to judge your ROI unless you have some really solid KPIs going back to that extreme systemization.
So if you can measure that, you'll find almost every single time that you’re passing a message to your in-house staff. Not making mistakes allows you to save money and make your business more profitable. We were talking about the farm and we had gone through all this. So, as a tribute to my environmental background, I decided to call the system’s framework, the e-commerce operating system. Or the ecosystem for short.
That's very cool, man. That's quite a journey. I'm surprised you were doing that for 25 years because you must be doing something right on the farm. You look pretty young to me.
Oh, it was just my birthday, so I guess I'm one year older.
So, how did you get into Amazon? What led you to pivot in a direction that Amazon was looking appealing to you?
Well, I guess as a high-ranking oil field official and with my job in particular I was, I was out in the field a lot of the time. And with the oil patch, if you have a major project going on that you're in charge of, you don't get to leave. So I’d spend sometimes up to three months straight up in these oil field camps trying to get these major projects finalized.
And that's a lot of time to spend in a camp. A lot of time away from your children too. I missed a lot of my daughter's formative years just by being away all the time and it sucked. When I came across Amazon in 2014, I just decided that at that point in time, I could see that the oil patch was on the way out. I knew personally that I needed to get out of, out of what was going on there. And honestly, after 25 years, it was probably time.
So, what better way to do it than to hit the next big thing? Because in 2014, my goodness! Amazon was red hot. You could do no wrong, basically at that point in time. You could fold paper airplanes and sell them on Amazon and still make a profit.
I got it in 2015, and sometimes I’d make a mistake and it would still make me money, Even when I did the wrong thing.
Absolutely. It was at the time. But that's changed now. Of course.
Yeah. It's definitely become a lot tougher. And I think that's really where what you bring to the table really adds a lot of value. It allows you to be competitive and stay on that path without being in the weeds all the time. And, I certainly use a lot of processes in my business. I know I could use more, but I'm to the point where I still don't enjoy riding the processes. However, I can push myself through it because I know how powerful they are.
I got excited in the middle of making one when I realized, “I won’t have to do this again for a long time. And this is going to serve me well until this process changes. It needs to be updated.” With that said, why don't you tell the people a little bit about what an SOP system looks like in your opinion? Especially as someone who has so much experience in this area.
As I said before, SOPs are processes and practices that set your organization apart from your competitors. You might hear ‘system’ out there. Many courses will call themselves a system. But that simply isn't true unless there are documented steps that can be followed multiple times.
In its simplest form, a system consists of documentation from every part of your Amazon and e-commerce business. This includes:
Selling on Amazon is a complicated affair. So, listeners should know that there are large brands and management companies out there. And they already have this all setup. They've got it tested and they’re dialed in. A major issue that some sellers have is that with in-house developed management systems the SOPs can be mismanaged easily.
Even something as simple as ensuring that your organization is using the same version of every document can prove challenging. Things change quickly on Amazon and you have to stay on top of system updates
Now the best-automated SOP systems solve these issues by applying basically six fundamental industry standards. And the very best systems are constantly updating the SOPs in real time.
The first of the six fundamental industry standards is the need for a defined systems onboarding process. There's a bit of a misnomer between onboarding and orientation. Onboarding is ongoing. It's happening all the time. It can last throughout a staff member's lifetime with your company. Whereas, orientation starts at the beginning to get them into the culture of the organization.
You make sure they have all the tools they need to begin the work they have to do. That’s what human resources really focuses on.
Orientation starts at the beginning to introduce the culture of the organization. Onboarding is ongoing and can last throughout a staff member's lifetime with your company.
But after that, you have to make sure that your onboarding process is well set up. So, when you hire people, they can have a smooth entry into it as possible. One of the biggest issues, we both know, is bringing in staff members, especially virtually. They may know the job that they have to do, but they don't know the system. They don't know how to integrate into it to get the best out of it.
And so that's why we say the first fundamental is a defined system onboarding process.
The second fundamental is a naming convention across all departments. And, this goes into the other fundamentals as well. It's really your baseline. You need to have a naming convention that can go across all of your business from file names to image names, and so on. If not, how can you expect your staff members to come in to know where to go?
Using different naming conventions in your images, you’ll get lost very easily
It’ll be difficult if you're using all different names for different things. For instance, if you’re using different naming conventions in your images, you’ll get lost very easily. And if we're talking strictly about scaling as fast as you can, number two is essential.
The third fundamental is the issue identification and documenting process. You need corrective action and you need change management. In the oil field industry, we call these NCRs or nonconformances. In a system, if someone screws up there should be a mechanism inside of it to document the issue. Put it down so that people know about it.
You need corrective action and change management.
After that, you work on your corrective action. What this does is fix it in your business. And once you've tweaked, tested, or dialed that in, then you move into change management. And change management could mean different things like replacing staff members to get rid of the ones that can't seem to hold onto it. Or you change your SOPs or processes. Make sure that everyone has access to those changed processes.
Number three is pretty important for a continuously advancing system.
The fourth is statistical analysis and KPI tracking. We know why that's important. We want to know how much money we're making. We want to know what kind of progress we're making. And without those KPIs, it's difficult to do that. It's part of a system; it's ingrained into it.
Number five would be an integrated project management tool. Or just a system, in general, for your project management. Now there's a lot out there like Asana, Trello, and ClickUp. But, there's an issue with those types of project management tools. One of them is that they're not necessarily specific to e-commerce. And secondly, they don't have SOPs already in there
Use ecommerce-specific project management tools that can link to your SOPs
They don't have an easy way to join your SOPs for project management. We personally got around this by developing our own task management software, which we call the ecosystem. And by being able to marry the two pieces together, we've made a great way to quickly get jobs going.
And lastly, your sixth fundamental is an EDM system or your electronic document management system. If you look back, you’ll realize that you need to get number two of the fundamentals before you can have your EDM system. This is important to make sure that everyone knows when you update your documents. There's nothing worse than fixing a problem, updating the process, and then the mistake happens again. It feels like you just went through all this and still messed it up. And that my friend is why that is fundamental.
Man, as I listened to that story I thought about your passion. You love being on the farm, your previous experience, and how you created this ecosystem. And how you blended your personal life with your work life. I love that, man because I know a lot of people talk about work-life balance. And I think that's important, especially, since I have three kids and a wife. I definitely want to balance all that stuff, but get confused with that.
I feel, as an entrepreneur, my work is an expression of my personal beliefs and values. And I feel you've also figured out a way to blend those worlds together, in such a way that is probably satisfying for you. But, you’ve also provided so much value to other people. I've seen your SOPs and I feel they’re the real deal. And if you can outsource that whole system to someone else, that's huge because, as you said, they have to be updated.
Amazon's changing all the time. Sometimes in very significant ways overnight that leads people to lose thousands of dollars in revenue in a few hours. If I wanted to change a process on my own, it could take anywhere from a day to a week for me to figure that out all on my own. And, that obviously depends on a lot of different variables.
But if someone can just come to Reed and say, “Hey man, I have this problem,” I'm sure you guys have a solution. You'll probably already have an answer form or maybe you've already even updated the SOP.
It's great that you've created that ecosystem where people can also manage the work being done because that was a huge hurdle for me. When I learned about SOPs, I felt, “Wow, this is great.” But an SOP doesn't necessarily get the work done on its own.
And I had to identify what I came to call a workflow.
At the end of the day, I want to build my business as big as possible. It's how I think, it’s how I operate. But I want to be involved as little as possible. And I've found that when I can accomplish that in the right way, my business does way better. The more I can delegate and bring on the right people to have systems and get out of the way, it satisfies me personally. But it’s also usually the better thing for the business.
That's the fun stuff of SOP. That's what people should get excited about because it might seem conflicting to want to grow your business. Especially when you want to grow your business as big as possible and do as little as possible. It's probably a very foreign idea to a lot of people who are not entrepreneurs. And, for me, it was like that before I learned about all this stuff.
I struggled with thoughts like, “How do I accomplish this? How do I satisfy my big vision, and my big goal, and just keep everything going the way that I want it to? I want to still be a dad and, and go have lunch with my kids during school and take my wife out for date night when I want to. I want the business to still be running with all the other activities happening. I want to be able to call work and say, “I got sick today and I can't come to work.”
How am I going to handle this long list of stuff that, for whatever reason, I feel like I'm the only one that can do it? And I think that's the other great thing about SOPs. It allows you to get out of that mindset of, ‘I'm the only one that can do this. Now I'm documenting what's going on up here and getting someone else into it. This gets me really excited about the SOPs and having that project management system. That was a huge hurdle for me.
I use ClickUp and I think of how to get my processes into the app in a way that the work can actually get done. And that’s an ongoing process for me. I've figured out some things, but I certainly have a long way to go. Can you talk a little bit about what that looks like inside of your system and who you really think your system is for?
Sure. As I said, I called it the ecosystem, but really the key is the ECOS at the beginning. ECOS stands for the Ecommerce Operating System. And so it's the shortened version of the term ecosystem. It's a melding of over two decades of experience into a format that is immediately actionable. It's easy to implement and it's e-commerce-focused.
You can look at the ecosystem in a very real sense by imagining an apple tree in the middle of a wide-open field. Without care and essential inputs, the tree will simply wither and die. The ultimate goal in this scenario is to grow the apple tree into a strong and healthy producer of succulent and really perfectly ripe fruit. If you look at the tree as your business, it starts to become apparent what is most important to the long-term growth and viability inside of your ecosystem.
An apple tree that’s well taken care of and fed correctly will consistently produce beautiful fruit for well over 50 years. So, what we're trying to do inside of this system framework is, give you the tools to plant, grow, prune, and harvest your tree for years to come.
If we ask, “Who’s a system for?” The best way to answer this question is to ask yourself what your ultimate goals are for your brands.
If you're looking to grow to seven, eight figures, and above then you need to at minimum start documenting what you do on a day-to-day basis. You can never be too small to get a system up and running. So in essence, if you’re an Amazon seller who wants to win and gain over your competition, then it's time to start.
I know that a large contingent of companies that use our particular system are, brand management agencies and brand aggregators. Under the ecosystem, we have over 20 of the largest and most influential brand management agencies working with our SOPs. So that's something that's coming up. These brand aggregators or brand management agencies who are experts (as a lot of them say they are) have their way of doing things.
But they have an advantage over your listeners who may be just a single brand owner. They have multiple companies they can be looking at. If they have an issue in one company that they're looking after or have aggregated, they can move that across their entire brand base. That way, they solve it before it becomes an issue elsewhere.
Basically, the future of Amazon, if you haven't started systemizing yet you need to go out there and do that. Start with the fundamentals. It's as easy a win as getting a naming convention. That's such an easy thing to do, but it takes time. So you have to put a little bit of that time into it. Get started. If you haven't hired any staff members yet, or you've only hired contractors every once in a while, here’s what will happen. When you hire that first full-time person, virtual or in-house, you’ll immediately know the second they walk in that you should have had a system.
You'll be running around trying to get things together when you really don't need to. In essence, all you had to do was click a button. If you had a template for that entire rollout of what they have to do, you could just assign them the name, and click the button. And all of a sudden, they're there ready to go. You've saved yourself a week, or two weeks’ worth of training work.
Just stick them on that task template. And, and you're good to go.
Yeah, man. When I look back at my journey, I wish I started doing SOPs and documenting when I was right off the gate. It'd have been better from the beginning because when you start to grow, you've got more operational stuff. You’d have more things to document. So now, you're a year into a seven-figure business that exploded out of nowhere because Amazon is Amazon.
Now you're like, “Oh crap, I got to document this stuff. I need to template all this stuff. While you still have to keep the business going as well. So it can be kind of difficult to take that step back and say, “You know what? for a week, I'm just going to do this SOP thing. And, we might have to sacrifice some revenue for a week, or some things might go wrong.
And it's not a good position to be in where you have those conflicting priorities. So, if you're listening to this and you've been on the fence about SOPs, you can talk to Reed about what they have to offer. But at the very least, start documenting, start writing stuff out. Reed gave a good tip about the naming convention. At least you can start getting some organization going so that you just get the ball rolling on that process.
As soon as you see what an SOP can do in your business, you'll want more of it. You'll get hooked on it. That delegation and outsourcing is such a good feeling when it finally clicks. And it's funny that I’m saying that because I used to be one of those guys who thought that I had to do it all. Were you ever one of those guys, Reed? Did you ever feel that way in business?
I was lucky enough. I want to say yes, but in essence, for over 20 years I was in the weeds of it. So I understood what delegation meant and why it was important. I have to say ultimately, no. It was somewhat easy for me to delegate. But it was the SOPs themselves that I didn't want to delegate. How do you trust someone with the roots of your company?
If you imagine the ecosystem as the apple tree, you’ll have the rainmaker, right? That Rainmaker would be you as a founder. And, that Rainmaker is raining down what we call the MVPs.
MVPs stand for your mission, your vision, and your passion. So, as a founder, you have to be the person who’s raining that down on your company. The rain goes into the soil, but you have to work it into the soil. So, that's where the caretaker comes in.
You have your COO or your VP of operations in there. They're working your mission, your vision, and your passion into that soil so that it can reach its roots. And the roots, based on this scenario, are your system, your SOPs, and the way you do business. All are documented in a format that’s revisable, modular, and able to keep up with the times. So, what you're pouring down into the soil, as the Rainmaker, moves up through that root system into the trunk.
The trunk here will be your staff, your virtual staff. Then you can see how your systems move up through the tree, into the trunk. And since you already have your MVP in the root system, it just naturally goes into the trunk and teaches your virtual staff their mission, vision, and passion. They need to know all that to be able to move forward. And, now your staff will be doing the work of course, and your caretaker will be taking care of them and trimming off the different things that they need to.
You can look at the branches as the issues in your business. Things that happen, or things that come up or maybe they're strong things like a line through what your staff is doing. If they're building a strong branch, that's going to hold your fruit. You’ll have to look at that.
And, ultimately your caretaker's goal is to trim out the bad branches. Those issues are going to either give you no fruit, or rotten fruit.
As soon as you can trim bad branches from your tree, the better...you want the strongest branches that are going to hold and produce the brightest fruit.
As soon as you can trim those out of your tree branch system, the better. What you want are the strongest branches that are going to hold and produce the brightest fruit. And, so you get to say what you want your fruits in your business at the end of the day. Maybe it's being able to take two weeks of holiday in Puerto Vallarta every year.
Or maybe it's being able to buy a farm on the river, so you can fish every day. But, you know, you have to make that decision as a Rainmaker.
I can't say it enough, but quality management systems are the only way to scale. I hinted before that some large brands already have this sort of system in place. What this allows them to do is to jump further and further ahead of your brand simply due to their system—they use it as a force multiplier Problems can manifest themselves in lots of ways.
They can include things like frustrated staff, or maybe you're missing deadlines, or you have noncompliance with regulations or terms of service. And, if you're an Amazon seller, then you've run into these issues. There are things like missed opportunities. All of this can lead to a slowdown in growth and ultimately the largest problem is an increased cost to the business.
So, you have to be conscious every day that your competition is using a system. They have that system already. And, and, basically, by having that system, they're growing their market share faster than you are.
Yeah, man, I think that's such a great way to explain it. Hopefully, a majority of people can understand that tree concept. I've spent some time working on a farm for a little bit. So I fully understand the concept of pruning back the issues and allowing the healthy ones to grow. It allows you to produce the fruit that you want. And I think that's just such a great way to describe it and it makes it a little more fun because a lot of people don't like to talk about SOPs and stuff.
You can think of it as a life-giving thing with different people playing important roles in its growth. You’re growing this business, and all these people are involved in it. It's just such a great thing. And I just love how you named it, man. The ecosystem, I think, is spot on. When you take a step back and see that you've created this business that’s operating on its own, in some way.
It seems like you've figured out a way to package that and provide it to people. And I know you touched on this being the future of selling on Amazon. Plus, we see all these big businesses now jumping on the bandwagon. I agree that the game is changing and it's happening right now and very fast. And if you want to stay on it, you're going to need some type of system. And some are better than none, as long as it's not a bad one.
Having some type of system is a great way to get started. So, this could be the elevator pitch. But I’m this guy. I know I shouldn't be doing a lot of things in my business, but I always have that urge to. I always have to fight against it. So, what would you say to someone who says, “Reed, I think what you're doing is great, but I'm going to create this system on my own? What's your opinion on that?
Well, I guess in essence, the answer is no. We typically can push out a finalized SOP in about six to seven hours, depending on how detailed it is. But then comes after that, the testing and the refinement side of things. And this really takes a lot more effort. It takes longer to do, and it's really where the costs are involved in your system Let's say it takes a day for an expert to develop an SOP.
You have to ask yourself if you have the time and the expertise to accomplish the task. You also need to ask yourself if you have the scope to discern if the process you're developing is actually any good. Earlier, I described an expert as someone who has access to multiple seller accounts or multiple categories. So once again, we look at the brand management agencies and brand aggregators.
They have that. They can look at different categories, they can see the issues coming out. What this is going to allow them to see is a broader picture of what success looks like. So if you have that tunnel vision of success and, and you're not putting your processes and your system into it, and you want to take the slow road. As I said, we’ve timed out in our business.
We time out how long it takes on average to do a process. And it takes six to seven hours unless you're testing it. But the process may as well just be on a piece of paper that you can burn. If you only have your own account as scope, then you're very limited in what you can successfully develop.
On that same note, you can for sure develop your own SOPs. There’s a benefit to doing it yourself, and it costs you nothing but time. And if you decide to develop the system on your own, then there are two ways to distinguish how to proceed. If you've already developed most or some of your processes, then there's a different approach than if you start right from the beginning.
And so, and that's why I was talking about the six fundamentals. Those can really apply to both. You can as long as you're taking care of those things, you know, it's a list of six things, but it's a deep list once you start diving into it. If you're working on it constantly, then you most certainly can develop your own system. But like I said, it’s going to take a lot of time. It just is.
If you have that time, go right ahead. If you feel that your brand needs specific things stated because you're in a specific category. And you feel it needs specialized regulations and stuff like that. Then, maybe think about writing that process and then incorporating ready-made ones into your business.
Ultimately, the goal of a system is to take your hands off the work and be able to scale. Nick, you and I are fairly successful sellers. And, we surround ourselves with what I’d like to say are the best and most accomplished Amazon sellers in the industry. And we both know they are constantly working on their processes. It is something that is a key part of their business.
It is something they take time out of their day to do on a daily basis. And, the delegation of those systems is time-consuming. So you have to, you have to decide. Do you value time, or do you value the little bit of money that buying that system is going to cost you? So you have to weigh those two.
Yeah, man. I think what you guys have to offer is huge for the industry, especially with what's happening right now. And, as you talk about this, I'm reminded of an SOP. To me, it reminds me of that research paper in school that I never really wanted to do, but I had to do it to get to the next level. Then, I put it off and try to cram it in the night before. And I could usually skate by, but I don't want to do that in my business.
I want to be at the top, man. I want to be high-level. I want to be competing with the biggest companies out there. I think that’s a great thing that Amazon has to offer. Whether we realize it or not, we're leveraging their systems and processes in a huge way. It allows someone like a fresh entrepreneur to really not realize how much goes into running a business.
But when you get to a certain level, it starts to hit you and it can be pretty intimidating and it can be a huge hurdle to overcome. If someone wanted to learn more about what your systems have to offer, where would they go to find out more about that?
Well, they can go to ecomprocess.com for the systems. But I also want to say that I have a book called “The Ecosystem.”
I think Amazon and e-commerce sellers deserve a system that's custom-fit for the specialized way they do business. But right now, there isn't a systems framework that really does that. We're forced to use hybrids of existing frameworks and ultimately it doesn't work as well as it should. So, my book ‘The Ecosystem,’ I feel, is going to change that.
In order to get you started immediately, I have an exclusive offer for those listening to us on this podcast. So if you want to head over to ecomprocess.com/MDs and purchase my book. And I'm going to include a massive process package. This package is worth much more than the book—you don't make money selling books. But, I'm going to let you choose between a few different process packages.
So, you can choose which one's going to fit your business the best. So, grab that special offer while it lasts.
Yeah. And if you're on the fence about this, I can vouch for Reed. He’s the SOP guy, and he really knows his stuff. There's just such a huge trust factor, not just because you're in MDs as well, but just because I've seen what you have in there. And I know the type of person that you are in the sense that you really enjoy what you do and you take it seriously.
You're not going to provide something that would not provide massive value. And the fact that you've created something unique for Amazon sellers is huge. I don't know if there's anything like that on the market right now that’s doing it at the level that you would be doing it. As you mentioned, there's some other stuff out there, but it's not really that complete system. And the SOP themselves aren't gonna take you probably to where a lot of us want to go.
You need that workflow system, that project management system that's going to incorporate all this. And, I think it's probably what you identified as those six fundamentals. What you're providing to people is a fully packaged solution that doesn't just provide these things, but helps implement them. And it's going to keep it up to date and allow you to focus on growing your business and getting that fruit that you want.
Whether it's a vacation or, for me, surfing trips and time with my family. That's what I want. That's what's important to me. And that's what something like this has to offer. So if you're listening to this and you're on the fence, I really hope you take Reed up on his offer. I'm pretty confident it would change your business in a huge way. So definitely check out his website.
Reed, thanks so much for coming on and sharing all this stuff. I think it's such an important part of business and it's something that a lot of people need.
Thanks, Nick. Hang loose brother.