Hey! What's up, everyone? This is the Million Dollar Sellers podcast. I'm your host, Nick Shucet. Today, we have a special guy, Mr. Leo Limin. What's up, Leo? How're you doing, man?
Hey Nick. Hey guys. Hey MDS. Happy to be here. Thank you, Nick, for inviting me here.
I'm stoked to have you here. I know you've been a long-time member of the group and have added tremendous value. You’ve accomplished a lot of things for yourself and for other members of the group. So we're excited to have you. You mentioned that you were initially in Vancouver. I know you spend a lot of time in Mexico though. So why don't you talk a little bit about how you ended up in Mexico and what you're doing up in Vancouver as well?
It's a very long and winding story, but we're primarily in Mexico because it's a nice place to be. It's a good place to have a team because running a business and hiring talents are inexpensive there.
That's interesting! You don't hear a lot of people talk about that when it comes to Mexico. I love Mexico because I love going there to surf. I'm definitely familiar with the great and cheap food, cheap places to stay, and so on. You can have really good experiences there. But I’d like to know how you found out about Mexico.
I went there frequently for different reasons. To start with, my wife is Mexican and we've been together for over 20 years. I found my first software business partner in Mexico as well, and he was Dutch. So, that's how I started in the software.
Mexico… is a nice place to be. It's a good place to have a team because running a business and hiring talents are inexpensive there.
Mexico for me is a very good place to run a business because it's the same time zone as the United States. Mexican people are educated, similarly to Americans. A lot of them speak very good English because they were educated in the United States. And I don't understand why everybody isn’t running their VAs and hiring people out of Mexico.
I know you've got so much great stuff you could share on the call, but maybe if we have time, we'll dig into how you can go about hiring someone in Mexico. I haven't looked at that myself either. There are so many great things that we could talk about with you as a founder of so many amazing software that Amazon sellers use. You co-founded RebateKey and Pixelfy. Now you're in Elite Seller.
The earliest Amazon software we did was called ZonPages and it's still live. It's a landing page creator where you can give away your coupons and also run ManyChat campaigns as well. Pixelfy was based on a simple idea of super URLs—not all URLs are equal. It eventually became the place to go for people to generate special URLs that performed specific actions and helped them with ranking.
Elite Seller is the latest project. It's a software suite. The platform provides everything you need. As a platform that you can use for large accounts and multiple accounts, we primarily look for large sellers and agencies for it. It also works well for collaborators. You can have large teams running different parts of your software within Elite Seller.
Yeah, I'm a fan of Elite Seller myself. I love all the collaboration that can happen there. Even as a brand manager, my team and I get to share stuff with clients, so they can see it. We definitely use a lot of the dashboard data, and send out weekly reports to clients, among other useful things. So, I definitely agree that it’s really becoming a good all-in-one software and I'm trying to use it for about everything I can.
I'm trying to replace as much stuff as I can with Elite Seller, so we use it every day. However, you mentioned that you came to Mexico pretty early on and got involved in the software business. But how did you get into this world of e-commerce and Amazon?
Then, things just took off because she could put all my dreams into reality much faster than I could do that. We did multiple projects such as Mexican Yellow Pages, Mexican Week, and even the Mexican Airbnb before Airbnb existed. So we have a large portfolio of projects and huge experience. We have our own framework and eventually, we got into games, mobile games.
We did games even for Disney, and I got interested a lot in mobile applications and I started a product that was a smart bulb and it required software. And that's how I got into Amazon because where are you going to sell it? on Amazon. So, I started with private labels and learned all about the Amazon space. So software plus Amazon, it all goes well together.
That's quite a story. It sounds like you were really playing that visionary role with some big ideas and you found this guy to really help you implement all those things. Does that sound right?
I'm very happy with what we do, where we are, and where we go. And, of course, not without the help of my business partners, Ian Sells, Johan, and MDS. I was in MDS since it was called the 50K group. I was in China back then when Ian started this whole thing.
Yeah! I remember once laughing at a random post that occasionally pops into my head. Ian had gotten a reminder of when Leo had joined MDS and he shared, “We're still waiting for Leo to add value here.” It was so funny because you were pumping out so much good stuff in the group and creating all these great tools and extensions and stuff that people could use. Although he posted that a long time ago, it has stuck with me ever since.
I've gotten so much help from you, and you've added so much value to the group and are definitely an important member. But how about you? What are some things you've gotten out of MDS that have helped you with business and your personal life as well?
Probably one of the most important things in any success in any business is to surround yourself with like minds. People who are like you. And that's what MDS gives.
Since no one is an island of knowledge, MDS provides the platform for multiple questions and answers.
You have a sense of belonging. You can always ask questions and get the answer because we don't know everything. None of us is an expert in everything, right? So that's the place where you go and you get anything. You can get multiple opinions and multiple answers for any question, ranging from business, personal questions, and even health and fitness.
Like most members, without MDS, I wouldn’t have had this success. So, this group is the best thing that’s happened to me.
Yeah. I think a lot of people would say the same thing. I'm so grateful to be a part of the group. And as you said, when you team up with another MDS member, whether it's on a product or software, things really go to the next level fast. I've also noticed a trend in my own life. It seems every time I go to an event in person, something amazing happens.
I walk away more personally fulfilled with some amazing financial arrangements. It blows my mind every time. The last time we were in Mexico, we were sitting down with you and you had a bottle of Mezcal with Elite Seller on it. We sat around sipping on that Mezcal. And, I think your wife had a bottle as well with pine nuts in it.
Did you guys ever do anything with that, or was that just a personal thing?
We didn't do anything with that, but we can do it again for the next MDS. We can bring more Mezcal because we found more sources of good Mezcal. Last but not least, you asked me what I took out of MDS. I took Ian out of MDS and now he's my business partner. RebateKey, Elite Seller, and Pixelfy. So that's a huge bonus out of MDS.
Yeah. What a great team to work with. I imagine you guys have some big goals and are accomplishing some really cool things. What's on the horizon for Elite Seller and the other software you're involved with?
We try to stay focused on Elite Seller and RebateKey. I don’t want to do any more software till a big exit for Elite Seller. We’re adding more modules and we want to also add modules for Walmart and Shopify.
We’ll add more modules and build API for large agencies to use for their software.
We're gonna be building API that large agencies can use for their own software. So, big things are happening behind the ground. Our teams scaled 4X in a year, so everything is going up. Same thing for RebateKey it's been an amazing experience all through.
Yeah. I think RebateKey has the potential to be pretty huge. With so many people shopping these days, I know you guys are growing on the customer acquisition side over there, right?
Yeah. The mobile app is coming out within weeks. Also, with RebateKey you’ll be able to connect your Amazon, Shopify, Walmart, and any other account. Then push all your products to the rebate platform at a smaller rebate value. We wanted to be the place where people shop rather than the place where people only search for good deals.
I've known about RebateKey for a while. And, naturally, if something's too easy, I'll question it and put myself away from it for a little bit. So, that was what I did with RebateKey. I felt the platform seemed too good to be true, so I explored other methods of doing rebates. And now I'm back on RebateKey. It's just so simple and so easy to acquire customers for a product that we're launching on Amazon.
For people listening that might be put off by the simplicity of the platform, Please explain how RebateKey works for a seller on Amazon.
Well, a lot of people are using RebateKey to launch their products on Amazon because they can get sales velocity relatively quickly. We have a lot of people on the platform looking for deals—about a million. What you do is offer a rebate on your product and the better the product, the better the rebate, the higher the sales velocity. You want to keep your products on the platform to maintain your sales velocity.
But, it's also quickly becoming a platform where people simply sell their products at a discount. You can put your whole Shopify website with a certain discount with coupons, and so on. We also have coupons because we eventually want to be a platform where you place all your products with a certain discount, with a certain rebate and you just get more sales. That's where we are going.
It's very big because, within four years, everybody who invested in the early stages has grown.
Yeah. I missed the vote on that one. I was bummed. When did you guys create that software, RebateKey?
I believe four years ago by MDS. Ian came up with an idea of rebates and I told him, “Hey Ian, why don't we do a platform for it?” he said, “Oh, can you do it?” and I said, “Yes, of course, I can do it.” So, while we were talking, I made the page where we just connected Stripe and said, “Hey, everybody can invest. We are selling 50% of the company for a hundred thousand dollars.”
We offered 50% of our company for $100,000 and collected money within 24 hours. However, our investing specialist asked us to never do it again.
That was quite silly because our investing specialist told us “Don't do it again, ever.” But anyway, that's how we started. And we collected money within 24 hours. Everything from MDS. I think we became profitable within a month because everybody who invested also started to put their products on a RebateKey right away. We have a lot of products.
At the same time, I used to have a website called Zone Deals and basically started to advertise RebateKey within that platform. And a lot of buyers jumped in from Zone Deals to RebateKey. And also on Facebook. We started to advertise and very quickly, we became successful.
That's insane! That's absolutely crazy! That's such a cool story. And I know a lot of people are probably getting interested as they're listening to this if they haven't checked out RebateKey. And, I think, the big question that always comes is “What does Amazon think of RebateKey? From what I understand, you guys are an actual approved Amazon application.
I mean, you can even go on the service provider network and see RebateKey up there. Is that right?
Not in service providers, but software providers. So RebateKey is listed on the Amazon app store for Amazon sellers. And, we've been verified, and approved and there’s nothing wrong with rebates. Also, RebateKey isn’t an Amazon-specific platform. You can list rebates for any platform of any website, whether it is your own Shopify site, Walmart, or anything else even Target.
So anything you want, you can list on RebateKey.
Yeah. I've definitely used you guys for Walmart as well. Just get a nice, special link in there and put it on RebateKey. Or do the treasure hunt, and you're good to go. Again, it's just so simple and still blows my mind. You hear all these people spending $30 to acquire one customer on a Facebook ad. And I think it’s like three or four bucks on RebateKey.
It's definitely the way to go, in my opinion,
It's $2.95, and one thing you should know is that we aren’t a review service. So do not ask for reviews from your buyers. Use Amazon’s methods of acquiring reviews we’re not a review platform.
Definitely! And I know that for Elite Seller we use that review requester tool. We like to send that out to clients as well, and it can say “Hey, we requested 377 reviews in the past couple of days” or something like that. They don't really even know that it's just some tool in there doing it automatically, which is super helpful for us and other brand management agencies I know of.
That's what we always recommend. Turn on the review request then provide good service and people will leave reviews. That's all.
Yeah. And it works out well. I like that new system from Amazon. It wasn't too long ago that they came out with that ‘request a review.’
They were squeezing out all the email automation campaigns where people put different wording for different types of customers to ask for reviews. And they just decided, “You know, forget about it. There’s a button you can ask for reviews and that's it.
It's definitely a nice feature. And especially to have that plugin with Elite Seller where it can just do it automatically. Are you working with any other methods to get reviews that are within terms of service, I know it gets a little murky on what Amazon allows these days. Is anything else working for you?
Yeah. Within Elite Seller, we have a lot of post-purchase funnels. If you offer your customers a warranty, some PDF manual, or a gift card, you can turn on those funnels and it makes this process very easy.
I’ve tested every single thing on Elite Seller with my products and followed certain processes. So, I won’t recommend something that doesn't work or get you into trouble.
We do recommend giving those things before you ask for a review, so it doesn’t look like it's a condition for the review. So we have funnels that you may ask for review before or after you provide some value to your customers. I’ve tested every single thing on Elite Seller with my products and followed certain processes. So, I won’t recommend something that doesn't work or get you into trouble.
What is your favorite part of Elite Seller right now?
The dashboards. That's what everybody checks in the morning before you even take a shower. You turn it on and check your daily, and hourly sales and your conversions. You check which products are performing better. The second one is alerts. Of course, all alerts should go to your VAs, not to you otherwise you don't have life.
The alerts show you when anything is down. For instance, when you lose your buy box or, experience a price change for some reason. Things like that Also, the recent module that we introduced within QR codes and links is very useful if you deal with your packaging. If you want to put this pretty QR code on the packaging and take it to your funnel, we now have magic links.
These links make you rank magically a little bit better than using other methods. I'm not gonna go into the details of how it works, so you have to be an MDS member to know that.
Yeah. I like the QR code feature a lot too. I've messed around with other QR code providers. You pay 30, 50, a hundred bucks a month, for a QR tool. I've used the one that you guys have in Elite Seller as well and it really does make it so simple. I think I've used QR Monkey which was very user-friendly. But I found the Elite Seller one to be very user-friendly as well.
And you can do some really cool things like brand your QR code with your colors, shapes, and other things you want.
The best is that you can rotate and exchange any links you want. For example, today you want this QR code to lead to a particular page and tomorrow to another page. These are things you can’t do with QR code monkey.
Right. that's what’s called the dynamic, right? Where you can change the destination of the QR code. I think the QR codes will become more useful in the United States, at least. And I think we have COVID to thank for that. When you go into a restaurant now, the QR code is right there for you to scan for your menu.
Uh, they're not really handing out the paper menus anymore. Two years ago, not everyone really knew what a QR code was, but I think everyone does now.
Now is the time to use it on your packaging, your postcards, and so on
Is there a feature on Elite Seller that you’ve been working on, and are close to rolling out? I know you guys got a lot of stuff going on over there.
Actually, a newsletter is coming out this week. We rolled out a bunch of features and updated designs, much prettier designs for our funnels. More alerts, more dashboards, and widgets.
We add features as Elite Seller members make requests.
The dashboards are widget-based, so you can put any widget you want and move them around. There are a bunch of things that will come out in the future, but I don't want to give away too much. I’ve noticed that once we announce something, all our competitors are starting to work on the same thing. However, we're going to release more funnels and more features for agencies, such as reporting, modules, and more.
And also anything that’s missing is coming up. Members of Elite Seller and other people who use the platform constantly ask us to add one feature or another. Since these users are large sellers or agencies, we listen to them and give them what they want.
Yeah. I'm excited to see what you guys come out with. I have so much faith in Elite Seller and the MDS community. I know they're pushing you guys to add a lot of great stuff and you’re also working very hard on it, so I know it's going to continue to be great. We'll also be using it a lot for brand management. I know you're crushing it in the software world, but what else are you working on?
What are you doing for Amazon right now? Are you launching new products or anything like that?
I gave away a lot of control in those brands that I was working on. I had to reduce my share and get more partners. But, I believe that software is my biggest business right now. I'm very much into supplements, so I know a lot about it and all the suppliers, providers, and so on.
I know how to do it, how to launch it. A few days ago, I launched a product. I used the Elite Seller funnels and I used only a magic link and it beat every single keyword search ranking right now. And it doesn't even have reviews, which is very well. I like to look at it more like experiments, and eventually, if the product picks up and starts ranking, then my partner take over and deal with it. Scientists!
That is such a cool way to do it because I think of product ideas probably at least once a day. Sometimes, I say “That’d be a cool product to launch, but then I’d get lost in the full implementation process. I'm good at getting stuff off the ground, but then I want to get out of there and move on to something else. So, it sounds like you've set up a cool workflow for what you've got going on.
That’s something I’m definitely working on myself. I've been able to pull myself out of a lot of day-to-day stuff and get more involved with MDS, which has been great. I love working with those guys and getting to know the community more. So it sounds like you've really got yourself in a position where you can really focus on what you enjoy doing and what you're best at.
Was it always that way, Leo? Or did you go through that stage in the beginning? Like most of us, we try to do everything ourselves. We think we're saving ourselves money by doing it that way, but really we're just holding ourselves back.
Yeah, I think all of us went through the same steps, and your business will only take off when you start delegating.
When you reach your first one or two million, you must delegate.
We all know this well when you reach maybe the first million, first two million in revenue. You can do everything yourself, including customer support, but then you should start letting go. That's the only way for you to scale it and focus on top-level ideas and processes while your team does all the real work. That's the only way to grow.
And then the only thing you need to learn is how to manage people how to build teams and how to find good people, which is the most difficult part.
Is there a pivotable moment in your life where that mindset shift kind of happened for you? I know that something terrible always has to happen for me to snap out of it. What was that like for you? At what point did you decide to stop trying to do everything yourself and start building your team and delegating work?
It's MDS actually. Before that, I had only small teams and only people who worked 24/7 and I was still not happy with their work. Now in MDS, there are so many people who know how to build teams that I listen to. That’s when I knew that I was holding back myself by not allowing people to take on other tasks in my business. So I think MDS is a pivotal moment and it happened three years ago, maybe.
So that's when my team started to exponentially grow.
Now you're involved in all these other things that have allowed you to grow exponentially. With you getting out of the way and staying focused on what you're best at. I know that's how it's been for me. The more I remove myself, the faster things tend to grow the way I really have always wanted them to.
As I mentioned before, the most difficult part is to find those key people who will hold the whole structure together. So if you're not good at hiring, at least get some help because you need very good people. And then everything grows.
I was in a coworking spot for a year and met a guy that does hire there. He found someone good for me locally who's been managing some brands under our brand management agency. It actually felt good to just say “Hey man, here's the job description. Uh, here's what I'm looking for. Let me know what you can find it.” I've done it both ways and I feel like I've gotten pretty good at hiring.
I've done a lot of it on my own, but even if you're good at it, you still have to go through a few people to really find that ideal employee that you really want. You mentioned that you're building a team in Mexico. Like how do you go about that?
Our team is not only in Mexico. We obviously have part of them in the United States. We also have an office in Prague, Czech Republic. And I believe we have 12 people working there already and we are hiring more because those people have a different skill set. In Mexico, however, we hired pretty much every single good headhunter.
We hired them all and they kept bringing us resumes and they screened people for their criminal records, like psychological tests, and so on. Once we get somebody there, we don't have to waste too much time. We just evaluate their skills and it's been amazing. Everybody we hire, we love them. I don't have anybody that I want to fire.
That's pretty cool. So you guys go the headhunter route? Wherever you're trying to hire, you just look for someone else to do it for you.
Yeah. Also, don't forget about LinkedIn. The platform has a lot of resources, especially with Recruiter Lite, I believe. That's why I look for more advanced people who look like they’ll be good for the job. Even if I don’t have a position for the job, since this guy is so good, we're going to create a position. So at that point, you headhunt a little bit.
Yeah. I agree about LinkedIn. I found someone recently. I've always heard about Six Sigma. I don't know if you're familiar with Six Sigma or not. I found someone in the Philippines on LinkedIn with a Six Sigma certification and she has come into my business and just like completely blown me away. Every time I meet with her, she's got something new that she's showing me that helps get everything out of my head and display it to the rest of the team properly.
So if you're listening to this and you haven't leveraged LinkedIn, give it a try. I saw the recruiter feature on LinkedIn, but I think it’s pricey if you aren’t using it actively. But, if I was hiring pretty aggressively, I'd definitely give it a shot. However, I went on my business page and I did a remote job in the Philippines and put the job post out and that's how I found mine.
So it's a little workaround if someone's looking to save some bucks and not go the recruiter route.
The problem with just posting jobs is that all the best people are usually hired. So you really have to go after the ones who are working for your competition or who are working in a similar field and seduce them to work for you. Use the amazing project that you have or by giving more money.
Yeah. You're right about that. I think I got lucky. The girl I hired was working for another Amazon seller. I just came in with a better offer and I think kind of more of an online presence, you know, with my website and stuff like that. I think she was doing shipments at her other job, and here she is with this great certification for Six Sigma. So, I told her “Hey, you'll be doing SOP and business process improvement.” she was so excited.
I mean, this lady is so happy to write SOPs and improve our business systems. And that's what you want. You want to find those people that are thrilled to come to work.
Exactly! You want them to be as happy as you are, so hiring a person is like a marriage. They want to like you, they want to love you, they want to love your business they want to love their workspace and our workspace. We have a massage, a Gym, a cafeteria. We also have a barista on staff that brings lattes and macchiatos and God knows what to employees at their workstations.
So all that adds up to happiness and more productive workers.
Yeah. Sometimes I see MDS members talk about their workplaces and I feel like I would almost take a job there. It sounds so much fun. I see you guys doing the TaeKwonDo too, right?
No, it’s Karate
Yeah. I'm a big fan of that stuff. I was pretty excited when I saw you guys post a few shots at your team together. All dressed up and looking super cool. I definitely agree with you. If you can make your employees happy, you will get so much back from what you do for them. Well, Leo, before we wrap up I have a couple of questions for you. Just some fun questions and then, we'll wrap up. All right.
So my first question for you is what is something you hear people say often in business that you do not agree with?
Well, that's a difficult one. It depends on the business. In our business, when people say, “I don't have to know how it works for my business to work,” it's incorrect. You have to know everything, about how it works for your business to work, especially when it comes to Amazon. I see a lot of these people, including at MDS that are clueless about what's going on with their business.
And I can bet if they would learn their own business a bit better, everything would be much better for them.
Yeah, I agree. It's easy to fall into the habit of just hiring someone that seems like they know what they're doing and maybe you don't know anything about it at all. And, you think you found someone good. But in reality, you could have found someone much better if you had just taken a week to really learn what the role is about.
And if you're in MDS, it's as simple as making a post in the Facebook group and saying, Hey, can I chat with someone for a few minutes and learn,
Save so much time honestly. And whatever people pay to get into that group comes back in multiples,
Yeah. I talked to some people who literally make their money back in a week. There's some shipping and logistics or supply chain or something that just saves them thousands of dollars. And they've immediately 3X their investment for getting into the group. I have another one for you. What's something you're working on right now with some habit, maybe you're working on trying to improve or something like that.
Yeah. I have a personal coach right now. I'm trying to control my brain frequencies when I work. Control emotions, be able to breathe properly, meditate, and stuff like that. And I think it works. I recommend to every entrepreneur, not only to look at the business from a technical point of view but also from a spiritual one. Be very well connected with the surroundings, and with people around yourself, and then everything will become much better.
You can study something like Kabbalah and it will work for you.
Yeah. I think that's a great tip. People need to think about that holistic lifestyle. Your physical health can be on point, but maybe your mental health is not, and that's going to limit you. And then you have the spiritual aspect as well. Although it’s not always about religion, spirituality can mean different things to different people. Just be in touch with yourself and the people around you.
Being empathic can go a long way. Are you messing with any binaural beats? I've been doing those recently.
Yeah. I got all those apps and a list. We're all messing with those things now
Yeah. We're all messing with the same stuff. That stuff works instantly. I feel like it’s changing the way my mind is working. What about hobbies, Leo? What are you into when you're not building software or crushing it on Amazon?
Other than the Gym, I play basketball with my kids. I like to bike and do martial arts and, do anything that keeps my mind, body, and spirit together.
Yeah. Martial arts is great. It's more than just self-defense. I get a lot out of doing it. It's a great way to surround yourself with a community of people. Although it becomes rowdy sometimes, they're a good group of people. So, I have one more question for you. In your opinion, what sets a successful Amazon seller apart from an unsuccessful Amazon seller
You have to be connected with yourself. If you feel stressed in a negative way, then you're not going to be successful. You have to be happy about every little or big theory, every little step. So success is a long way. You can’t jump to success. You can only walk to success. And if you’re happy about every little step you're going to be successful.
So like Bill Gates said, “focus is important.” So I think focus, persistence, and desire to learn set a successful Amazon seller apart.
Yeah. I think that's a solid piece of advice. Amazon throws so much nonsense our way. So, you have to have a goal in mind and be grateful for those little wins. Since Amazon's going to have so many roadblocks thrown your way. So, you’ll find it difficult to stay positive if you don’t celebrate those tiny little wins. Well, Leo, thank you so much for coming on. It's been super cool chatting with you.
Where can people find out more about you if they want to know about RebateKey or if they want to find out more about Elite Seller?
Well, you can always connect with me on Facebook. I use it mostly for business, not for personal use. You can find me at firstname.lastname@example.org.
Yeah. Thanks for coming on. And I hope to see you at another event soon.
Thanks for having me, I’m not missing that.